Brent: 0:00

God says, yeah, that shame's not coming from me. I'm not putting that on you.

Thomas: 0:04

So whatever minute and second this is in the podcast, save it, record it.

Trisha: 0:10

Seeds for your marriage. Welcome to Seeds For Your Marriage. I'm Trisha and this is Thomas Walker. We have with us here, Brent and Suzanne Lokker. They're senior pastors of Blazing Fire Church in Dublin, California. Welcome to the show. We're so excited to have you. Thanks for having us.

Thomas: 0:30

Thank you. So thrilled to have you here today. You've talked about honor. honoring one another. You've talked about trusting one another. Communication, I would imagine, has to be an area where you've invested. to make sure that your relationship is thriving, that you understand one another, listen to one another. Are there other core values that you would call out in your relationship with each other that come to mind?

Brent: 0:58

Another core value is family. And I share that because we both have a huge value for our own blood families, our and of course we already talked about the church family, but I'm saying that's why, for example, we spend two days a week. Caring for our granddaughters because we made that choice together that this is super important to us to, to love on the next generations. And the more we do that, the more joy that brings back to us and we're starting to see, I will say this, I feel like we loved our kids very well. We were not the perfect parents. I have not met those yet. I haven't met the perfect parents who haven't, wish they had a couple of days back and, Or seasons back or something, but no, we actually love them. And what I mean by that is we continue to affirm them. We continue on their bad days. We didn't disconnect from them. We didn't punish them that we corrected. We didn't punish. You know what I'm saying? You're a bad person. We didn't do any of that kind of stuff. And as a result, we have amazing relationships. Friendships with our now 30 year old sons, approximately. 30, 32 and 29. And so I'm just saying, but because we both share that value, It's not been difficult to, one of us isn't trying to pull the other to come on, come spend time with my family. We both want to spend time with our families, as much as we can. And I think we've been, in our families, I think we've both been bridges. We're the ones that often create some peace. In different family situations, sometimes are looked to for that, because we hold it in such high regard, but that's been really important for both

Trisha: 2:44

of them. Absolutely. Yeah, grandparents are so important. I just remember even growing up how my grandparents were, vital in my development as well. It's, there's something that I think kids get from their grandparents that they don't always get from their grandparents. From their parents. So yeah, absolutely. Yeah, that's great. That's a blessing. You're able to do that.

Suzanne: 3:08

Yeah. Yeah. I could not do it.

Trisha: 3:12

Yeah.

Suzanne: 3:13

So we are joined.

Trisha: 3:16

Speaking of family. So we are all. God's family and we're children of God. And so I'd love for you all to talk a little bit just about what does that mean to be a child of God? What does it mean to understand our identity and why is it important that we understand that?

Thomas: 3:39

In three minutes or less. No, I'm just kidding.

Suzanne: 3:42

That's crazy.

Thomas: 3:42

That

Suzanne: 3:45

is the question of the day. It seems. It seems. Because it's, that's what's on our heart, you have God dreams and a God dream that we have is for people to understand that, how really, truly a treasure they are. Back in the day, again, it was Danny Silk. And he, we're sitting at dinner and he says, he asks me, So Suzanne, what do you want to do? And this was early days of ministry, right? And I'm new to being a pastor's wife and all that. And so I really did, I didn't have a ready answer, and it took all of dinner and the end of the meeting for me to finally come up with an answer. And and it was to, I want to. Find treasures in people and just I think even last week Brett and I were having this discussion and I said in the scope in the Under ministry, what would I do with my life in ministry? And I said okay, I want to call out treasures and people. And Brett said to me, he said honey, maybe you've limited it too much. What if that's just the call on your life to call out treasures and everybody, regardless of being in ministry. You, that's just who I am. I'm like, I hadn't thought of it that way. In these last 20 whatever years that I had answered that question. I always thought well, that's my ministry call but it's me and learning and knowing who I am and If we can be if I can be a cheerleader, a champion of friends and family, anybody that I encounter to call out that same treasure in them, whatever it is, or just to help them see that they are a treasure. They are a child of God, and they, you've been given this amazing life, and and you have a piece of God. You are a piece of Jesus. You are a facet of His light and love, and so let it shine the best way that you can. And so in knowing that, as more of our Peeps is who we know the people around us, who we have influence with. If that can spread, how will our community change? How will, starting with our nuclear family, to our community workplace, school, city that we live in, and really change the world. The world, honestly, and then it's one person at a time and you know that saying it's one person at a time. What if that one person is you, right? Okay, let's go. Don't get me going here. I'm going to get on my, but

Brent: 6:50

It's,

Suzanne: 6:51

To so get that inside your being. That you are a child of God, and you have value, and worth, and you just smiling at somebody else could change the course of history for that person, or that person's family, it's so that is the dream. That's it. Then I guess that the Lord is releasing more in my heart is to try. And how do we do that? Lord, how do we do that on such a scale? And I know it starts with my own heart, but how do you do that? And call people up to where they really are. We are seated in heavenly places. And that's where we can see others from not the base stuff down here, where we are above that. Yeah,

Brent: 7:44

that's a good, if I can chime in just for a minute, I please, I so appreciate that. And she lives it. She, this is just who she is. And So yeah, the identity question and what difference does it make? It is it's the core of we're going to be to others how we perceive ourselves. Basically, we will love. We will love others the way we love ourselves, which is unfortunate. It's because we don't love ourselves. We don't love ourselves the way God does. So we start in other words, if we're really brutal with ourselves, Self judgmental, that starts showing up this way. And that's because we have not fully received the perfect love of the Father that requires nothing to receive that love. We're loved because we're loved because we're loved because we're his and that's it. The opposite of that is that orphan heart that feels like we don't have, we're not enough. And that's where we start to see a lot of destruction is what we're seeing in the world. It's where the hatred comes from. So if we don't know who we are, it's going to start showing up in some really bad ways. Yeah, destructive, disconnected ways. Different way of saying it is, Jesus said what you freely receive, freely give. And so we have to freely receive. Love. I say it this way to people. I say, what if we're, people are always looking for their purpose in life. What's my purpose? What if our number one purpose in life was to be loved? To be loved. I don't think very many people think about it that way because it sounds too self absorbed or whatever. No, genuinely be loved by the Father. That is a game changer of all game changers, because then love can't flow through you.

Thomas: 9:30

Yeah.

Brent: 9:31

Then you will love well. That's what will come next. Yeah. Yeah. But I think a lot of times, especially in Christian circles, we're trying to get it right. We're trying to do the Christian thing, which is not saying it's bad, like it's admirable. But we're trying to do the stuff and trying to get it right and love everybody the right way without Receiving at first and saturated, which is why I wrote this book.

Thomas: 9:54

Yeah. So we're on our way there. We're on our way there. That's like right around the corner. There's something that you just said that I now forgot. But I want to go back to Suzanne first because you talked about the. The ministry kind of call right in pulling out treasures. And then Brent expanding that to saying, what if that's just who you are? And that's who you are in all settings. And I just want to connect that to my professional career because I've worked in corporate America and I always struggled with who I was at work and who I was then when I came home, because I was putting on this persona to go to work. And finally, I began to realize. I just gotta be me. I just gotta be who God made me be. And so I now work at eBay and there's awareness. I'm a Christian. There's awareness that we run a nonprofit. There's awareness. We work with couples. And that's just who I am in all settings. So I want to connect that back to the authentic. piece that you talked about, which is just being who you are. And I'll put an asterisk on that, which is not being who you think you are, but being who the Father says you are. And there's a, there can be a, at some point, those things come into alignment, we hope, right? More and more over time, but there is, there can be that disconnect. And so that I just for what it's worth. I just want to pull that out for people because it's so powerful to its identity, the authentic and allowing ourselves to be that person, no matter what, and no matter what the consequences might be of being that genuine individual.

Brent: 11:39

This is a huge subject. So I will try to make it really quick. But I think if you look at the Genesis story, the authentic Adam and Eve was the one. Enjoy life with the Father. No care in the world. Daddy who loves them for no other reason than because he loves them. They get to co labor with him and with creation. And then something happens. Distortion enters the picture. They have suddenly a distorted view of who they think God is. And therefore who they think they are. Now there's hiddenness. Now there's shame. And the Father says, Why are you hiding? When they say, Oh, we're naked. He said, who told you were naked. In other words, it wasn't

Thomas: 12:25

me.

Brent: 12:27

That right there, I think, is the setting. And I said it's a huge topic. But I'm saying that's the setting for the issue we have and what we are, the gap we're bridging, as you mentioned, getting closer and closer, from the false narrative of who God is, the false sense of who we are. And now, because of Jesus, we're starting to agree with who we've always been. We're not trying to become something. We're coming into agreement with the Father, who the Father has always known us to be. So that we don't have to hide. So there is no shame, no condemnation. That we finally realize, I am who I am. Created perfectly in your image. And that's how you, that's the only way you see me.

Thomas: 13:12

So in that model, Brent, I tell me if you agree or not, we're not striving. We're being.

Suzanne: 13:19

Yes. And it flows so naturally.

Brent: 13:25

Yes. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. What Jesus has invited us into is a whole lot. easier in some ways than we've made it. My, my yoke is easy. My burden's light. And we do all this striving, everything to try to get it right. Be the good Christian. Be the good son or daughter. And we have a Father that says, you don't need to do any of that. And then we see, we have all this shame, all the things we do wrong. And God says, yeah, that shame's not coming from me. I'm not putting that on you. This is big.

Thomas: 14:00

So whatever minute and second this is in the podcast, save it, record it. I love that, right? Whatever shame you're getting, you're not getting it from me. Never. If we can just

Brent: 14:13

remember that. That's, part of this big deception. That it's coming from the Father. It's not. It's not. It's not.

Thomas: 14:23

Are you ready to go to the book? Yeah.

Trisha: 14:25

Yeah. I guess for me, there was a shift for me years ago, maybe over 10 years ago when I learned that I freely have the inheritance from the Father, that he gives me everything. He says freely received. Like just really receive and I never understood what that was. I never understood He has an inheritance for me. Like I didn't get that. I didn't understand that And even back to the prodigal son, he was given an inheritance He left but he didn't understand he was just out squandering his money. He didn't understand who he was He didn't understand the the the identity of who he was. He didn't understand even the value that his Father had given him. He didn't understand any of that. But when he was in a pig slop, came to a realization, what am I doing here? I don't belong here. And when he came back, his Father freely just, Put a ring on his finger and open his arms and grab them and held them, And so if we can think about I would think about our relationships in that way about with our Father in heaven And how yeah, he doesn't shame us. He doesn't school us. He doesn't You know want us to work. You have to work all these things for this inheritance He just really gives it to us

Thomas: 15:48

So when you said, the prodigal son was in the pig You know, while I'm with the pigs and he finally realized like, okay, this is not who I am. I just want to, I feel compelled to say that what I'm in that story, he had to take a stand. He took a stand in that moment and said, this is not who I am. I am this person. And I think what I'd love to connect that to is sometimes we have to take a stand on things that are coming against our marriage. And in our relationship and say, I, I am not, I declare this is no longer in our marriage. I declare that I am no longer that person. I declare that I will no longer behave that way. And, but we're not doing it from a behavior modification standpoint. We're doing it from a heart change from a Jesus. I cannot do this on my own. But in your strength, I know this is not what you would want in our relationship. This is not what you're saying about my spouse. And so I take a stand against it. I believe that when we take stands, certain, like Things happened in the spirit.

Trisha: 17:02

Yeah.

Brent: 17:13

Her spirit's getting charged up over what you're saying.

Suzanne: 17:18

Absolutely, Thomas. Yeah. That was it. She

Brent: 17:22

was talking. It was just

Suzanne: 17:25

about

Brent: 17:25

the Yeah. Just the agreement in the spirit.

Suzanne: 17:30

Yeah. Amen. Amen. Amen. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Brent: 17:36

And the Father. Embraces the son, just in case people don't know the rest of the story, and takes him in and doesn't let him finish an apology speech, not even interested. I'm getting back to this because we don't know who our Father is yet. We keep thinking we have to appease him in order to be accepted. He doesn't even let him finish the apology speech. He's not interested. Son, you're home. This is all that matters. Let's shames. And that, by the way, is the inheritance. I think we start to realize that we have this in the world, we have this mindset that the inheritance is stuff.

Trisha: 18:15

Yeah.

Brent: 18:16

Money with stuff. Yeah. House. Yeah. No, the inheritance is the word and we are his inheritance, which is Right. Amen. Crazy to is

Thomas: 18:24

you know what's crazy is grace as well, the love and grace, like we talk about love and grace being the book ends of marriage. So on the grace side. I just finished reading a book. I was in London last weekend. I read a book, The Pursuit of Grace, and it's actually interesting because in the title is what the pastor's trying to break, is that we don't have to pursue the grace. It's been freely given. Absolutely,

Brent: 18:52

100%.

Trisha: 18:55

Yeah. And when we can understand that, and we can get that, we can bring it into our marriage or into our family or whatever relationships that we have, because we have the authority we understand now there's a shift. We have authority in Christ.

, Thomas: 19:09

we can

Trisha: 19:09

approach his throne, with grace we can approach his throne. powerfully and be able to pray those things be able to take a stand in our in a relationship We can take a stand and realize that we have access to there's a court of heaven and he is God's the ultimate judge, but we're not the one being we're not the one being judged

Thomas: 19:32

Wow,

Trisha: 19:33

so I think

Thomas: 19:35

There's lots of seeds being plopped right now. Almost.

Trisha: 19:38

Totally. The Father

Brent: 19:40

judges no one, and has given all judgment to the Son. Three chapters later in John, Jesus says, You judge by human standards. I judge no one. There's things in Scripture that are really so mind boggling and don't fit with Some of the things that we have thought

Thomas: 19:58

the

Brent: 19:58

Father is. I'm just offering that as more things to ponder. Yeah. That was John 5 and John 8.

Thomas: 20:06

And your favorite scripture is 1 John 3, 1.

Brent: 20:10

That's one of my faves. Okay,

Thomas: 20:11

you have

Brent: 20:12

many. Ephesians 1 is my favorite chunk of scripture. Okay. Verses three to seven right in there. I love first John three, one. Yes.

Thomas: 20:20

Yeah. I was wondering if you wanted to talk about that and what it means to you.

Brent: 20:25

That we are God's beloved children. That's who we are that I, yeah I'm just trying to think of what else to say that I haven't already said. So I'm, it's just, it's by his choice. See, we weren't there. The covenant that we are a part of was actually made between Father and Jesus.

Thomas: 20:51

It

Brent: 20:51

was made between Father and Jesus before the foundation of the earth. That's why I love Ephesians 1 so much, that I just mentioned. We were chosen in Him before He made the world. When did Christ die? First of all, according to Revelation, The lamb was slain before the foundation of the earth as well. In other words, it was never an afterthought like, Oh no, this didn't go as we thought. And now they've run amok. What are we going to do? I guess Jesus will have to send you in. No, it was always a covenant of love. Between the Trinity, actually, Father, Son, and Spirit that we were invited into. God created us because love always wants to include more. We were just like, why do we have children? Because we want, because we wanted to. Because we wanted to have a little one to bring into our lives and share more love with. We were created for the same reason. That's why we're created. It was to be invited into this love covenant that was established long before we were ever born. So we get to agree with it, but it's not our agreement that makes it does that make sense? It does. It just is. It just is. And then we can enter in and enjoy. Yeah.

Suzanne: 21:58

One of the I think this fits here, but something that Brett likes to say at a wedding, and he gives the example of as the couple becomes one and he brings his hands together, And he says, and so when you guys, learn to love each other, you're as one, right? But if you together, if you're bringing the other person up, then you both go up. But if you bring the person down with your words, with your actions, whatever. You bring both of you down. Yeah. And it's that visual. A lot of the time that's a visual for me as as we look at our relationship, am I really calling out the best? And my husband and am I helping him in that and he, for me,

Thomas: 22:47

that's good,

Suzanne: 22:47

And are we constantly being each other's cheerleaders is what he's, he said before in that and so that, that love covenant, it's huge, but it comes from a place of understanding, Father's love for us, and what we've received.

Brent: 23:07

Oh, can I read those three verses? It's from the message, because I love it in the message. I'm not going to preach it right now. I'm just going to read it. Husbands, go all out in your love for your wives, exactly as Christ did for the Church. It's a love marked by giving, not getting. So there's that self giving love. Christ's love makes the Church whole. His words evoke love. Her beauty. This is that calling of the treasures and what it does. Everything he does and says is designed to bring the best out of her, dressing her in dazzling white silk, radiant with holiness. And that is how husbands ought to love their wives. They're really doing themselves a favor, since they're already one. in marriage. That's this thing. Yeah.

Thomas: 23:56

So Pastor Brent, this is so good. And we face this a lot with, and I think this is a human condition, by the way, what I'm about to describe, which is that scripture, husbands, Go all out for your wives. Right now, there could be a wife that's listening to this right now. That's my husband isn't going all out for me. And the whole description of what a marriage should look like. And so now I'm building the case against my spouse. Do you have any advice for. Someone that might be doing that because it's very easy to do which is, yeah, I'm going to use this scripture to show you what you're not doing.

Brent: 24:36

Wow. It's one of, I think it's one of the most misused scriptures the way a couple of versions earlier, wives submit to your husband's yeah, which the verse right prior to that is submit to one another Or as this one says out of respect for Christ be courteously reverent to one another So there is a one another and there is I get to do my part. That's all I can do So it's my choice Let's get back to that again to honor my wife and in part of that and I'm just gonna say this is That I am I have to choose to take care of my heart in such a way I'm going to say this a different way. I think when I wasn't caring for myself when I was not the husband that, Is in this scripture, then she had to put her guard up her walls up to keep herself safe. And then I'm thinking, what's her problem? What's the attitude or what's the whatever, in other words, I'm like, it's like you said, it's so easy to do this thing. And if only you would just do this. We wouldn't have this problem anymore without seeing at all that what was going into my heart, how I was contributing to this. So what the Lord shown me along the way is if you. Will become the safe husband for her which means loving her in this way But if you will become safe now Over time she'll be able to let that guard down and now and get this is what God was telling me And then I will be able to work on her heart, but she's expending so much energy keeping herself safe She can't even do this stuff. So that's what I would say to a couple is guaranteed. The more you will receive the Father's love, let him deal with your own heart issues. It will positively impact your marriage and help your partner, your spouse, to begin to then do, go on their journey in a safer way and be more able to do that. It will impact your relationship. It may take some time. This is not, we're looking for that. I did my part, now you gotta do your part. No. Like for example, asking for forgiveness. No. If you've done something wrong, you go to them and you own your part and you ask, I'm sorry. Please forgive me if she doesn't respond. Even if I think she should. That is a non-issue. Yeah. It's not about that. Yeah.

Suzanne: 27:08

And I think that what you're saying, honey, is it goes for the woman as well. That that whole aspect of working on your own heart. And looking at their spouse and their husband or whatever, like the example that you gave, if she's saying, he's not doing that for me, but then here's an opportunity to look into your own heart and say, how am I a safe place for my husband to become? To become who he really is And sometimes we don't want to deal with that alone. It's their problem, not mine And if i'm honest, it's no where you know, where have I you know, am I tearing him down in this situation? You know am I not building him up and come to that Realization, It's oh wait, this could be some of me You know and so lord, okay You What is it in my heart that you want to change, and how can I be a safe person? For him, my husband.

Brent: 28:12

And I mentioned earlier about hiddenness being one of the problems in the original story of the Deceptions, right? And hiddenness is a really big problem. When there's hiddenness, there's something's wrong. And I, but I want to say this, that sometimes why we hide is because we don't feel safe. We don't feel safe just to put it out there because we're going to get slammed. We're going to get punished. And all of us learned as little kids, especially if many people have had parents that punished them, some, sometimes, very brutally and what did you learn as a child is if you're going to get punished, what you learn is next time I'm going to hide it better because you could try to be a good kid that now, don't you ever, I'm punishing you so you'll never do that again. The problem is we all can repeat things or go back to something or, And then if we experience punishment the last time, we're going to hide it better this time, which then starts the whole shame cycles, hidden shame cycles. How do you break out of that? And that's, that's where at some point you have to be courageous enough to say, I've got to talk to somebody. But eventually, of course, you want that somebody to be your best friend, to be your spouse. This is why we need to be really safe for you.

Trisha: 29:25

Yeah.

Brent: 29:26

That's

Thomas: 29:27

really good. I think we have to two more questions and then we're going to land the plane.

Trisha: 29:31

Yeah. So

Thomas: 29:32

we're talking about the book.

Trisha: 29:33

Yeah. Yeah. So you wrote the book always loved, which I know so many people have read and it says you are God's treasure, not his project. So can you tell me a little bit about your book and just. Yeah, I'd love to hear more about it.

Brent: 29:49

Sure. Yeah here's treasuring on this project. I think that really fits with some of the earlier things we said. We have sometimes such a poor self image. We think God can maybe barely stand us, and so he's trying to. Do something with this project that he doesn't know what to do with. And no, he's actually going to love us into holiness is what he's going to do. He's going to tell us who we are until we believe it. And so that's how I wrote the book. I wrote it to, I would say, angle after angle of how the Father loves and why he chooses to love us in this way. And that there's nothing you can do to stop him loving you this way. The first half of the book, I just laid it on thick. And then I talk about how can we know this is true, not just wishful thinking, and I talk a bit about covenant, like we, we just did, His covenant with us. And then, finally, What you receive, you give away. So the last couple of chapters are about how love flows out from us. But I wanted to help people get off the performance

Trisha: 30:51

treadmill

Brent: 30:51

that is killing us.

Trisha: 30:52

Yeah.

Brent: 30:53

And we talked about that earlier. And not that, by the way, you mentioned the prodigal story. That's the older son. That trying to do everything just and then when the Father shows mercy, the older son is ticked. But what does the Father do? He goes out of the house to go get him. We don't know the end of that story, but I'd like to think both of the sons make their way into the house. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yes, it's also in other languages. It's in Spanish. It's in Arabic. It's in Chinese. It's in Uganda Thousands of pastors have read it there because I've been there four times to Uganda Just helping, again, a lot of cultures, our culture included, but a lot of other countries, there's a lot of legalism. Because that's what people were taught. Nobody's fault, but there's a lot of angry preaching and, trying to pound sin out of people and oh, that's not going to work. I've tried that. It doesn't work. So it's fun to be able to release this and to see it all the again, the stories coming back. I also, I don't know if this is the right time to throw it in there, I have a YouTube channel, it's called Vibrant Life, and about the time COVID started, so the last several years I've put out, a hundred or two, two hundred videos, some of them are myself, some with just like this, conversations with people, but all of it is around a really good Father, And how do you help, how can people understand that so that they can enjoy this relationship and not be hiding from one they think is disappointed. And I would just say to everybody God is not disappointed in you ever. Like that right there is a life changing statement. If we could believe it.

Thomas: 32:33

Yeah.

Brent: 32:34

And here's my proof text if you want it, because disappointment implies that God had certain expectations about you that you didn't meet. Therefore, he's disappointed. I have great news. He has no unrealistic expectations about us. In Romans 5, it says, while we were still sinners, Christ died. He knows who he came to, after. And his love will have nothing less than to have his children back in his house, in his arms.

Thomas: 33:02

That's beautiful. And you also talk, with the always love, like it's always on, and the unconditional. I think I just want to pull that word unconditional out as well. Brent and Suzanne, because it is unwavering and it's eternal. Yeah. Yeah. Nothing we can do to earn it. Nothing we can do to

Brent: 33:21

have it taken. Yeah. And I would say because we have such poor models of that everywhere, because no one that we know loves like that. Therefore, it's really hard for us to believe that's who the Father is.

Thomas: 33:33

Yeah.

Brent: 33:33

But that's exactly why Jesus came. He says, look at me.

Thomas: 33:38

Yeah. And I love that because just connecting back to the you this or you that, and I'm going to take my step. And the idea is I'm going to go apologize and then they're going to do this and they're going to do that. And then it's going to be great. And that's a conditional apology, right? Because I'm building my head. What's going to come after? And that's where a lot of frustration and disappointment can come in. So I just want to encourage couples. To love unconditionally the way that we're loved and don't put boundaries. Oh, not boundaries. I don't want to get about boundaries are a good thing. Sorry. I want to use that word. But not to put conditions on it to say, I'm only going to love you if.

Brent: 34:29

And I would just add and how can you love that way? You can't. Christ in you can't. We have the cheat code. Holy Spirit lives in us. But I'm just saying that because otherwise people will just listen to what you just said and say I'm out. I can't love that way. And That's what we believe. We don't understand. We are created in the image of love itself, which means we are love to the core of our being. We've just had some false ideas, false ego. You can call it a lot of things, false self that clouds the picture that gets us thinking the wrong things about ourselves. So I would say first you have to receive that unconditional love, which is why I wrote the book to try to draw people into that Father.

Thomas: 35:16

Yeah. So one more time, I'm going to say, always loved. You're, you are God's treasure, not his project. Yeah. By Brent Locker.

Brent: 35:24

Yeah. It's on all the outlets, Amazon. All the outlets. Audio. I did the audio, it's all on there. Yeah.

Trisha: 35:32

I think earlier you mentioned a little bit about just some inner healing and people getting, coming to a place of working on their hearts and getting that inner healing. And I know you do some inner healing work. It's called HeartSync. Tell me a little bit about that. What is, what does that entail? And, how does it help someone?

Suzanne: 35:51

That is. No. It's so deep and there's so many facets that, you know. Okay I'll start and then you please jump

Brent: 36:00

on. Yeah. Basically I just said a minute ago, how do we love like that? We can't. In other words, we can, but only Christ in us. It's God does the changing. We don't actually change ourselves. And it's the same thing. Yeah. with Inner Healing. It's inviting Jesus into the places, it's letting Him show us what we can't see, but He doesn't show us so that we can then fix ourselves. We still can't do that, but so that we can invite Him. Thank you for showing me that, Jesus, would you? Would you heal that place? Would you heal that little boy, that little girl that needs healing? What's that going to look like? Jesus will let you know. That's the whole beauty of what this actually is, what Inner Healing is, what HeartSync is. It's not a system, a program, and this is the, it always looks like this. No, it actually looks different every time because the Lord so intimately knows each one of us. And so I would call these those that, that, that lead this it's more of, they're more of guides just listening to Jesus and the Holy Spirit with you to help you go back and let Him reconstruct things, show, heal some things. And just personally, I mentioned inner healing, and so some of it was going back to grade school, some things that happened, and seeing Jesus there, and Jesus then became a Father to me, became my big brother. In other words, some people in this picture that maybe didn't give me accurate information, didn't respond or give me things that were right and gave me wrong ideas about myself and about life, Jesus came in to show me what was true. It was beautiful. And then, years later, He actually had me revisit the same scene, if you will. Only this time, I thought gosh, why are we here? I feel like I've forgiven, I've Jesus told me what's real, what's true. But this time, he brought me back because I was still struggling in some areas, and he said, I need you this time to actually have compassion on yourself. I want you to share my compassion for that little boy. Because there's things we need at different stages of our life that we never got. And But he can fill in those gaps. He's not bound by type. That's the beauty of all this. That's amazing. So that's a little bit about what it is. Yes, we do have a few people in our pastoral staff that are just amazing at this. And I would also say once sometimes I think it's really good to go to someone who's got some of this understanding. I just explained a little bit of it. To help you out. But ultimately it's probably Any of us can let Jesus do that, especially when we start understanding how it works, how he can move in our hearts like that. So in other words, to my example, I just gave you the first time I was with a Sozo team up at Reb, at Redding and Bethel. The second time was just me and Jesus. And let me tell you, we went deep and it hit, and I was sobbing and crying and giving compassion to that little boy. And then the coolest thing is I got to go to my best friend, Suzanne, because it was just a me and Jesus time, but I told her all about it. And you want to talk about real healing? When I told her the story, she cried with me for that little boy.

Trisha: 39:17

Yeah. I think this is. Like everything we're talking about. This just comes full circle, right? Where we're talking about being able to live in our marriage where there's nothing hidden, but so many times we've been hiding from ourselves, right? And so if we can get that inner healing and understand just how much. We are accepted by him, and no matter what memory he brings us to, no matter what circumstance it was, it shows our perspective in that. It allows us to be able to feel like we don't have to hide even from ourselves. And we can become more vulnerable with the person that we're closest to.

Thomas: 40:05

That's the journey. That's the journey.

Trisha: 40:07

That's

Suzanne: 40:08

the journey.

Thomas: 40:08

Said.

Suzanne: 40:09

And you guys do this well. I love it. I've watched some of your videos, the podcast and how you can synthesize some of the, what's going on. I love it. I love how that it comes together and then you guys just extract more to make, give a fuller picture or, of the theme and you guys do that well. I love it. It's great. You guys have me talking and I don't do

Thomas: 40:34

this

Suzanne: 40:36

to

Brent: 40:38

you.

Suzanne: 40:39

Honestly. Wow. I love where you guys are coming from. And it's so gentle. And your couple's devotional that, that section on identity is like spot on, that, and just even the prayer together of communion, it's yeah, reminding each other.

Thomas: 40:58

Yeah.

Suzanne: 40:58

So I do, I pray that for you guys that he'll bring out more that gift that you have to be able to read a situation and listen to a situation and then get the, what's, Get to the core that will be released even more as you minister to the people that you minister to and as they come and that you have the that you'll be blessed with energy and strength for the long haul with each one.

Thomas: 41:26

Yeah,

Suzanne: 41:26

Because you guys do.

Thomas: 41:28

God bless you. Thank you. so

Suzanne: 41:30

much.

Thomas: 41:32

We will. We will. Thank you so much. We received that.

Trisha: 41:36

Yeah, absolutely.

Thomas: 41:38

We love, just like you do, differently, because we're all individual and unique, but we love. We love the Lord and we love his people and we know that everyone has the victory. It's a matter of the revelation and the walking

Brent: 41:55

in it.

Suzanne: 41:56

Yes.

Brent: 41:57

So open the eyes of our heart, Lord. Yes. To see how wide and deep and expansive this love is. So good. Thank you so much. Then it was awesome. Wow.

Trisha: 42:06

So how can people learn about your church, about you? Find you online

Brent: 42:13

Blazingfire. org.

Suzanne: 42:16

And we do have a Facebook Blazing fire and then a YouTube. is Blazing Fire Worship Services. Yeah, and we meet physically in Dublin, California at 7485 Village Parkway in Dublin on Saturday nights at six o'clock.

Brent: 42:37

Yeah, Saturday nights and we go live. So it's on Facebook and YouTube. And again, my YouTube channel is vibrant life.

Thomas: 42:46

Thank you. Thank you so much for taking the time. This is lovely. Going to go back and listen to it again. You're the love that you have is It's amazing. And it's rooted in Christ's love for us and it's rooted in God's love towards his children.

Trisha: 43:02

I appreciate you guys being on here. It's an encouragement for us we just thank you for being all you can and just for being an encouragement for us. Yeah. Thank you for listening to Seeds for Your Marriage with hosts, Trisha and Thomas Walker. We pray this episode has given you tips and tools on how to thrive in your marriage. Be sure to subscribe to this podcast and follow us on Facebook and Instagram at Trisha and Thomas. We want to hear from you. Be sure to leave a review and let us know how we're doing. It's our desire that this podcast completely benefits you. So also let us know future marriage topics that you would like to hear about.